There are some people that end up spending a big chunk of their life trying to accomplish something meaningful and relevant. The problem is, by the time they do, they’re old, gray and approaching their dying days.
No so with Mr. Lee Boyce.
For a guy who’s well under 30, he’s managed to become a regular writer at T-Nation, Men’s Health, Muscle & Fitness, The Huffington Post, and more. He has also worked for one of the nation’s most respected medical clinics, is CPTN certified, and an accomplished track athlete to boot.
Basically, he knows a shit load about what to do in a gym to produce the results you want. So naturally, I invited Lee to come have a chat with me so that you may have a pool of knowledge in which your brain can bathe in. Or melt in, whichever comes first.
Enjoy!
The Interview…
me: Hey dude
coachleeboyce: Hey man
me: Glad to see you managed to figure out Gchat. You’re smarter than you look, fo sho!
coachleeboyce: haha. What’s up for the rest of the day?
me: I got coaching in the evening. Power Tumbling… teaching people how to flip without landing on their face. Though, some inevitably do.
coachleeboyce: nice
me: Yeah, so lets start this shebang. Welcome you tall freak of nature and hard work, and mad props for doing this lil interview.
coachleeboyce: No problem
me: Let’s start at the beginning, give us a lil run down of how Lee Boyce came to be from where you started initially. From what I heard, a mutual friend of ours told me you were a bean pole once?
coachleeboyce: Hell yeah. I was a skinny sprinter. I was lean, but I hit 6’2″ by grade 11… at 168lbs there was nothing much to speak for. Of course, being a typical highschool athlete, I FELT big. I got to around 185lbs by my senior year and looked like a basketball player; tall, athletic built but still considerably skinny.
The fact that many of the other guys were even skinnier made the buck eighty five go straight to my head.
me: So how long did it take to get to your level today (240?) and how did you do it? A little help for the young lads that are looking to pack on the pounds.
coachleeboyce: Hmmm… where to begin.
me: how bout nutrition since that’s what most people DONT focus on.
coachleeboyce: Well to start, I’ve been 240 for many years now. Nutrition is huge for a skinny bastard like I was once (ESPECIALLY if you’re YOUNG and skinny), you can’t be afraid of carbs and fats. You can be taking in TONNES of carbohydrates because bar a few, your metabolism will be burning calories like a furnace – especially if you’re even moderately active. Learning how to train right and eating like a horse are the keys to weight gain. And weight gain is the key to not being skinny. We’ll get to muscle gain after. There’s no point to working out hard in the gym in any way, shape or form, in the pursuit of size, if you aren’t taking in more calories than you put out, through basal metabolism and through your workouts
me: Agreed. It’s funny when guys think they’ll get “fat” when they load on carbs. I’d like to slap these mofos with an oatmeal bag. For the average young male, is there a macro breakdown that you’d prescribe?
coachleeboyce: Macro breakdown? Lol naw, just try to take in 1.5x your weight (lbs) in protein and 2x your weight in carbs in terms of grams. These are good basic guidelines. As far as meals go, a staple of mine was good ole’ chicken breast and sweet potatoes.
me: Y U NO ANSWER QUESTION?!
I kid, and those are basic solid guidelines.
coachleeboyce: lol. People overthink this stuff. I’m in no way a nutrition guru. Far from it. But making muscles grow, and making weight come up and come down is easier than young people make it out to be.
me: It’s true, I constantly have to stop myself from over-thinking. I think the problem(?) is that there is so much good info out there, that you want to incorporate it all. Then we gota bring ourselves back down to Earth and be like “one thing at a time”.
coachleeboyce: Exactly! Only after a certain training age will anyone realize that there are thousands of schools of thought on methodologies. People who are spending time scrutinizing coaches’ styles in search of “the best method” will stay skinny for LIFE. Why? because they’ll never find it.
me: You speak wisely, tall man. It’s true, I sometimes get emails saying “is your method the BEST method? If not I don’t want to train. I want to train using the BEST method”. I’m like its the best if you give me solid data and follow the fucking thing… otherwise it’ll serve you no better than CrossFit.
coachleeboyce: Your response is more than what mine would be. I’d log out. Drives me bananas.
me: Indeed. So while were on the topic of training, here’s quickie: The average Joe (or Juliette) is looking to make themselves a decent, not-so-horrible strength training program. Three tips on decent program design?
coachleeboyce: The skinny average joe?
me: Sure.
coachleeboyce: Okay, my first tip would be to think of movement planes rather than muscles. Strength is created due to a sum of forces working against a resistance. Focusing on high volume biceps and triceps when you’re weak as a house of cards won’t get you any stronger. Focusing on pulling and pushing muscles, however, can do alot for you. Make it directional: vertical pushing and pulling, versus horizontal pushing and pulling. It makes it easy to train the total body, release a lot of hormones, and perform many large functional movements.
Secondly, I’d say to start from the ground up. I just did a segment for the morning show I’m on earlier this week about chronic pain, and I mentioned that things like the lack of tissue quality and structural balance are direct antecedents to joint discomfort. Long story short, if a skinny bastard expects to squat 300lbs in 6 weeks, he’s gonna have to make sure muscles like his VMO, Adductors, Glute Medius, and Psoas are all firing properly. Take the time to work on foundation movements in order to maximize strength, otherwise you could be exacerbating muscle imbalances. The aftermath is never fun.
Thirdly, foundation aside, nothing beats standard, old school barbell training. This is fact. My advice? Forget instability, and use Unilateral work sparingly when starting out. You cannot produce maximal force against an unstable surface, meaning you can’t train your strength to improve as effectively if you’re using these methods. This is where most kids go wrong. Training beginning strength is different than training strength of an intermediate, and both are different than training for hypertrophy. It is very important to make this distinction.
“You cannot produce maximal force against an unstable surface” (Tweet This)
me: I think that 3rd tip will go a long way towards people not looking like complete morons. Awesome. Speaking of media, I saw you were on the CityTV, CTV and the likes. How’d that go? And what did you talk about?
coachleeboyce: Oh I’ve done several segments for all of them. One of my old clients was the late great Mark Dailey – anchor for cityNews. We got a couple of segments in together during the 2 1/2 years we worked with each other. Currently you can actually catch me talking training on First Look morning show on SunTV.
Generally I talk about a variety of training related topics – normally related to fat loss and the like, since our fat country is so fatly fat.
me: Tell me about it. Big market share for us, I say. It’ll take plenty of life-times to eliminate fatness from this world. Ain’t gona stop me from trying. And on a side note, it’s pretty awesome that you worked with Mark Dailey… know as “the voice of CityTv”. R.I.P
coachleeboyce: Oh yeah, he was a good guy. A friend, actually. Sad to see him battle the Cancer. And true, regarding market share.
me: Now I know you’re a TNation… or, TMuscle writer (whatever it is they call themselves these days). What I wanted to know was, do you have any tips for aspiring writers on how they can write for bigger publications (besides having to know their shit)? Give us a lil break down on how you ended up there.
coachleeboyce: To be honest, I’d start by picking a magazine that you’re interested in and getting into it waist-deep. There’s no point in making a mass proposal to publication after publication because editors will see that you don’t have too much knowledge of any one magazine – theirs in particular. To get into TNation, I had already been reading their material for a long period of time, which then led me to pursue the next steps in getting my thoughts in front of the editors.
My next tip would be to remember that persistence pays off. Pitches will get denied. People will not like everything you have to say. It happens, but how you act in response is what matters.
me: Right on. Yeah you’re one of the few authors on that site who’s content I’ll actually read. Now let’s discuss plateaus when it comes to strength and fat loss. How would you handle each respectively?
coachleeboyce: If it’s not a weak link that’s the issue, often time’s it’s some kind of physiological process that isn’t going the way it should. Strength plateaus, for example are usually due to CNS overload from, well… too much strength training. De-loading weeks are key.
Most fat issues are hormonal. So much of it is diet. The rest is stress. Keeping 2 hormones at bay (cortisol and insulin) will do wonders for getting lean and busting a plateau. luckily those two hormones are probably the most controllable ones in our body.
“Strength is created due to a sum of forces working against a resistance.” (Tweet This)
me: How about exercises that you see guys/gals do in the gym which are a complete waste of time?
coachleeboyce: lol, I see countless
me: Haha true. Top 5 then. So people don’t hate you and go cry in a corner
coachleeboyce: Hmmmm… its usually the “combos” that drive me nuts
me: Ah the mish-mashes
coachleeboyce: Like a stiff-arm pull down converted into a triceps press down at the end. Row – kickback combo. I once saw someone doing hang cleans on the BOSU ball… like… why? Kipping pullups. is that 5?
me: (in kipping’s defense, it’s needed in gymnastics for bar skills… but only if you’re in gymnastics)
coachleeboyce: yeah, and we know CrossFit junkies aren’t going to attack the pummel horse on their off days anytime soon.
me: Indeed. Actually, the correct term is “CultFit”
coachleeboyce: lol
me: Did you see this by the way? I thought it was an April fools… till I realized it wasn’t April: http://www.livestrong.com/video/3953-do-squat-bicep-shoulder-press/
coachleeboyce: OMG. I closed the window.
me: Haha. No one I know has gotten through the entire thing. It has almost become a DARE.
coachleeboyce: That can’t be serious. I don’t even know where to start, so I won’t.
me: She’s been a “certified” trainer since 1995. I didn’t know such stupidity existed back then…but I guess it did.
coachleeboyce: It’s a snowball effect as to where you get your start… regardless if you did university study, or just got a weekend certification, NEITHER of these have much carryover into real training scenarios. It’s reading material and being coached that makes you into the trainer you become.
If you start by learning flashy stupidity that takes people further away from their goals, then you’ll get caught up if you don’t take a step back. When i started out I was 19 years old.. you should have seen the crap I put some clients through. Luckily I was able to turn things around, for their sake and mine.
me: Interesting theory, I think the snowball effect is a legit phenomenon if the mindset is whack. Those that get their certification in say, CultFit have such major blind spots towards anything else, that they reject it. And like you, in my early days I did some stupid shit… but one thing I never had was an ego. I searched for the truth. Speaking of which, who were your early influencers?
coachleeboyce: Well shortly after I turned 20, I hired a trainer myself at the local gym at which I worked. He taught me a lot of the basics on strength and hypertrophy training. I had ego. It was bad combination. Came from my skinny highschool syndrome I’m sure. Other early Influencers came from things I read. Eric Cressey, Chad Waterbury and Nate Green were definitely 3 notable names to me. Nowadays I’m a fan of both Poliquin and Rippetoe (though their styles clash often), Gentilcore is great too.
me: I’m a huge Poliquin and Cressey fan myself. Seeing Cressey’s monster 600lbs pulls is what drove me to achieve 3x body weight pulls myself. I’m like if THAT guy can pull such enormous load, sure, I’ll read his shit.
coachleeboyce: lol
“…Nothing beats standard, old school barbell training. This is fact. My advice? Forget instability, and use Unilateral work sparingly when starting out” (Tweet This)
me: So, if you could snap your fingers and change one thing about the fitness industry in an instant, what would it be and why?
coachleeboyce: The ease at which people can be deemed “professionals” in the industry. I get that people will all suck when they first start out, but there shouldn’t be any variables as to why they’re certified to train clients’ bodies. It scares me… basically there needs to be tighter standards to pass a training school. Perhaps even to enter training schooling.
me: But there are guys that slip through the cracks and do well, so I think there are pros to it as well. I hear what you’re saying though. When you train someone, their shit is in your hands. I think Dan John said it best when he explained his first rule of being a strength coach: “do no harm”.
coachleeboyce: True enough
me: Alright man, so let’s end off this interview with a Rapid Fire round. I’ll ask you 10 questions, you answer them as fast as you can in 1 sentence or less. Ready?
coachleeboyce: Lol sounds good. what’s less than 1 sentence though? haha.
me: Hmm, don’t worry it’ll be like the Oscars… I’ll cut you off when the time’s right. First question: Three things people should start doing right now to be more awesome.
coachleeboyce: Stop limiting themselves. Stop making conclusions based on insufficient information. Start exercising regularly.
me: 2. Current favorite supplement?
coachleeboyce: Fish oils
me: 3. One quick tip to attain monster strength
coachleeboyce: Gain weight
me: Nice
coachleeboyce: With size comes strength.
me: …and toilet clogging abilities. Now stop giving people an excuse to be fat! Number 4: Three fitness books everyone should read
coachleeboyce: Starting Strength – Mark Rippetoe. Strong Enough? – Mark Rippetoe. Assess and Correct – Eric Cressey
me: 5. Personally, do you prefer to press or pull?
coachleeboyce: Pull
me: 6. You favorite pull exercise of all time?
coachleeboyce: The Clean
me: 7. Beer or the hard stuff?
coachleeboyce: Beer – but I don’t drink at all. Probably had 6 beer this year.
me: Then it’s settled, time to get you wasted. Wonder how many shots it takes to drop a 240lbs 6 foot + lurch
coachleeboyce: Bahaha
me: Haha I know you want to find out! Alright number 8. Top guilty pleasure?
coachleeboyce: McDonalds!!! Bigtime
me: Ew
coachleeboyce: Dude. EVERYTHING on that menu is gold. Minus the fillet o’ fish.
me: Yeah you shit gold bricks too.
coachleeboyce: Lol
me: (Tho I agree with the filet o fish… who the fuck eats that shit?) Number 9. Favorite movie of all time?
coachleeboyce: You’re probably expecting a “scarface”, “rainman”, “color purple”. Hard to say, but Remember The Titans is up there…
Note: At this point, my stupid DSL WiFi modem decides to give up all hope and dies. Showing me more red lights than a busy downtown street. After a furious reboot, we continue with the awesomeness…
me: I’m back. Technology can really blow sometimes. Wifi died.
coachleeboyce: Ahaha
me: So favorite movie, what was it before my Bell modem decided to be French.
coachleeboyce: Haha, Remember The Titans, the memory of highschool football.
me: And finally, Number 10. Favorite bodypart you like to check out on a female?
coachleeboyce: Hmmm… the face and the hourglass shape in general. Girl’s gotta have hips.
me: Ah you’re a hip man. Means you’re subconsciously looking for someone to have babies with.
coachleeboyce: Bahaha
me: I myself am an ass man… which means I subconsciously want to have unlimited amounts of hot sex. And I have to say, it’s very true.
coachleeboyce: lol or you’re gay. Subconsciously of course ;)
me: Hey now, I’ll always give respect to a man with a great behind. But I’ll never touch… unless I have permission.
coachleeboyce: Haha, oh jeez.
me: If you think I’m gay, I don’t know what you think of Bret Contreras… he backs up his ass fascination with SCIENCE!
coachleeboyce: Hahaha. A masters in Gluteology.
me: Seriously, it’s scary how much he knows about glutes. You have to be obsessed with the ass to do so. Anyways, this has been a solid talk my man. Appreciate you spending some time in my world.
coachleeboyce: No problem. it was a good one!
me: For sure. Just before we go, let the folks know where they can reach you.
coachleeboyce: You can hit up my website www.leeboycetraining.com, and also find me on Twitter and Facebook. Plus, you can catch me on TNation as a regular Contributing Author.
me: Good stuff. Take it easy
coachleeboyce: Later man
“…the face and the hourglass shape in general. Girl’s gotta have hips.” (Tweet This)
Conclusion
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3 Comments
wow, excellent interview!
Lots of good things I can take away from this interview. I like how you emphasize the importance of basic, compound exercises. When I first got started, my personal trainer taught me the same thing and I remember how at that point I first thought I was going to waste my time with him – because I just wanted to get big arms and chest, lol. Anyways, today I’m really grateful that he taught me how to do squats, deadlifts etc. PROPERLY.
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